God and city: City Council prayer a hot topic in Tracy
by Eric Firpo/ TP staff
Jul 10, 2009 | 2346 views | 199 199 comments | 18 18 recommendations | email to a friend | print
Press photo illustration
Press photo illustration
slideshow
Tracy seems likely to once again become a legal and political battleground over prayers said at City Council meetings.

In the latest twist in a fight over the separation of church and state in Tracy, a Christian public interest law firm has offered to defend Tracy against a lawsuit should one be filed over the city’s policy of praying before City Council meetings.

The Virginia Beach-based National Legal Foundation sent the city a letter July 7 offering its lawyers to defend Tracy should the city be sued, a possibility in the wake of a letter by the Freedom From Religion Foundation.

That Wisconsin-based foundation sent the City Council a letter June 30 that urged the council to end the practice of kicking off council meetings with “prayers that unconstitutionally reference Christianity and invoke Jesus Christ.”

It’s hardly the first time the council has dealt with the issue.

Tracy resident Stephen Wampler recalls the mid-1990s, when a group tried to get the City Council to ditch the practice of praying at council meetings. Back then, Wampler tried to recruit the Rutherford Institute to help defend the city. Not much came of the challenge to prayer then, Wampler remembers, and the practice of praying before council meetings continued.

In 2007, Tracy City Attorney Deborah Corbett suggested the council bar the invocation of sectarian figures such as Jesus Christ during prayers at council meetings in light of a court decision that ruled those utterances illegal at government meetings.

Wampler alerted the National Legal Foundation in 2007, but the council decided against following Corbett’s advice, saying they might change their minds if the city was sued over the issue.

That day seems closer now.

At the moment, though, the Freedom From Religion Foundation is “going to wait and see what action” Tracy takes, said foundation attorney Rebecca Kratz.

She said the group wants to work “to get this matter resolved short of going to court.”

Kratz said the foundation has a member in Tracy who alerted the national organization to what was happening in the Tracy council chambers. The Wisconsin foundation keeps its membership roster confidential, and through the foundation the person declined to be interviewed for this story for fear of ridicule from people in Tracy who believe in praying before council meetings.

Wampler is one resident who wants the council to continue its practice of prayer.

He was one of several people at Tuesday’s council meeting to argue many of the Founding Fathers were devout Christians, noting they prayed for three hours at the first Constitutional Convention, and pointed out that pilgrims in the Mayflower Compact of 1620 wrote that the first colony was created “for the glory of God and the advancement of the Christian Faith.”

When Wampler heard about the Freedom From Religion Foundation, he once again got ahold of the National Legal Foundation.

“I thought, here we go again,” he said. “I think there’s been a rewriting of the Constitution in the last 33 years or so. It’s reached the point where the founders wouldn’t even recognize what they wrote.”

But to the anti-prayer group, the law is clear. It also wrote a letter to Lodi urging that city enforce its policy of barring sectarian references during invocations at Lodi council meetings.

Praying in the name of Jesus or Muhammad is “a no-no,” said Lodi spokesman Jeff Hood.

The council there has had two meetings in June at which those delivering the invocation were reminded of the city’s policy.

“We haven’t had any problem,” Hood said.

Tracy has no written policy on what can be said during council prayers, and it allows anyone to sign up to deliver an invocation. If there is a council meeting where no one has signed up to say the prayer, the city gets help from Mark Humphreys of the Tracy Ministerial Association to fill the hole.

But because anyone from any religion can sign up for the invocation, officials believe it does not run afoul of the law that bars cities from choosing one religion or religious group over another, City Manager Leon Churchill has said.

Interim City Attorney Dan Sodergren is scheduled to talk to the council about the issue in closed session at the council’s next meeting in August. The law allows for the council to privately discuss potential lawsuits.

Councilman Steve Abercrombie sees nothing wrong with how the council handles the invocation.

“We’ve all agreed that we have an open policy of whoever wants to come,” he said. “We’re not establishing a religion. We’re just allowing people to come and express their feelings.”
Comments
(199)
Comments-icon Post a Comment
anonymous
|
July 16, 2009
Ask em for the Torah.
Tinfoil
|
July 16, 2009
I upset the tourist time travellers today. I drove way out into the desert,got out of my truck and silently asked the tourist time travellers to point me to where goodies are buried. No response. I sat my butt on the ground,spent two hours under the blazing sun digging up a thousand pounds of sand & rocks. No artifacts. So in my mind I asked the tourist time travellers what gives. Moments later they spoke to my mind clear as a bell "You've been telling those people in Tracy what we're doing with you. This could upset the time-line. If the people of your era figure out that time travel is possible they may invent it sooner than us. Think of the implications. We'd be happy to give you more stunning artifacts but please don't tell anyone about it". Well,that did it. I sent them a mental message that from now on I'll be quiet as a mouse. Got a response "Thank you. Go out into the desert tomorrow and we'll give you something special". Hot diddly. Me so happy.
anonymous
|
July 14, 2009
The Chicago-based clothing maker declared bankruptcy in January, just after the president wore its suits for his inauguration and election night attire.

anonymous
|
July 14, 2009
I think we better start praying for our nation. Either that or start wearing new duds?

"As consumers cut back, businesses are scrambling. 14 brands you know -- from an NHL hockey team to Obama's suit maker -- that are hitting the skids.

The president's suit maker needs a bailout

Not even having ultra-dapper President Obama as a customer could help Hartmarx. The Chicago-based clothing maker declared bankruptcy in January, just after the president wore its suits for his inauguration and election night attire.

The company listed between $100 million and $500 million in assets and liabilities, and noted in its filing a "substantial decline in discretionary apparel purchases by consumers and by the company's retail customers."

Established in 1872, Hartmarx makes business, casual and golf clothes for its own brands -- including Hart Schaffner Marx, Palm Beach and Racquet Club -- and has exclusive rights to market under other luxury brands -- including Tommy Hilfiger, Burberry men's tailored clothing, Ted Baker, Pierre Cardin and Perry Ellis.

Currently, the brands look to survive under the guidance of British equity firm Emerisque, which bid $128.4 million for Hartmarx"

NicholasKruchev
|
July 14, 2009
Tinfoil,

There were a few established cities in and around Tracy, way back when. Ellis for one. I think San Joaquin County is one of the oldest counties in California.
maybenotdumBcommenT
|
July 14, 2009
Tinfoil as a matter of fact I know someone who found something underneath the Tracy soil of historical value but nothing that would make you a millionaire.
NicholasKruchev
|
July 14, 2009
According to another TP editorial they didn't do any fact checking.

I think the TP used another of their phrases that have earned them a spot on newspapers hall of shame; another typical use-phrase that will never get them a journalistic integrity award:

'someone said that someone said that someone said that someone said that someone said little, if any'.

I've exaggerated a little, but still it was vauge and seems typical of today's tabloid that we've come to expect.
shelly13
|
July 14, 2009
NK, do you mean that nobody else of other faiths volunteer to do the invocation?? Jimf01 I like the hammer analogy.

shelly13
|
July 14, 2009
Stupidstupid....you're right, they have no clue. I really do not know how they keep getting voted back in...?
NicholasKruchev
|
July 14, 2009
It is interesting to find that nobody has addressed the issue of why only a few people volunteered. Everyone else must have claims to have been too busy to spend the time getting involved in their patron, civic duty in America as our forefathers have done when writing the Declaration of Independance?
NicholasKruchev
|
July 14, 2009
Tinfoil,

California government is a "beast"?

Are you anti-government too?

Just askin.
anonymous
|
July 14, 2009


I wonder if the last two commenter's have never read the Constitution of the United States of America?

StupidStupid
|
July 14, 2009
Tracy people - wakeup! Religion DOES NOT belong in the city council meeting. Better yet - the city council doesn't belong in a meeting - what a joke to began with. Does the city council not have a clue on how Tracy feels about their actions. And for them to even allow a lawsuit come into the picture and waste all of the Tracyite's tax dollars - very stupid.
Tinfoil
|
July 14, 2009
I recall,years ago,discussing today's religio/political situation with an evangelical fundamentalist Christian leader of his community in southern California. I told him that this foray into politics by his group would someday destroy Christianity thruout America. I warned him that from a biblical perspective his group had by going-political joined not with God but with the Beast. We are seeing the result now especially among the young. Every day it gets harder to indoctrinate the young in religion.
anonymous
|
July 14, 2009
Wonder if the space tourists' favorite spots are the old landfills before plastic, styrofoam, and plastic bottles?

No believers and non believers has the right to "intimitate" other religion, each should be respected.

"Do not take the name of the Lord in Vain..."

Could be two ways of looking at it, in anger or self vanity to justify actions? Do not use God as an excuse.

NicholasKruchev
|
July 14, 2009
Jim,

You're absolutely right and it's not like they can't go down there to volunteer if they wanted. Only a few people volunteered to sign up and I don't see a reason for the Tracy Press to punish them for that.

Yes, I also noticed that picture on the front page of the Tracy Press attacking those who volunteered and trying to turn this around as something negative? Hmmmm.
JimF01
|
July 14, 2009
to reply to tin and mom, there is no doubt, religion is a tool like any other. With a hammer, one can build a home or bust someones head open. I am a simple guy, and I see the simple benefit of organized religion teaching good morals, etc. I can also see in the news that a fanatic Muslim in the middle east says his good book tells him he must kill me for not believing what he believes.

But I am not going ban hammers because they can kill people when used in the wrong way.
Tinfoil
|
July 14, 2009
Now see,a quick websearch turned up the history of Tracy and the Tracy Museum http://www.tracymuseum.org/. Tracy was going great guns thru the 1800s into 1910,petered out during the 1950s. What these means is you people are walking on buried artifacts the volume and historocity of which are mind boggling. I would ask that what you find you donate to the Tracy Museum. To physically dip one's hands in the sands of time quickly becomes an addiction.
Tinfoil
|
July 14, 2009
to maybenotdumBcommenT: I'll bet there are plenty of goodies buried 'neath Tracy. Tracy had to have had dumpsites back when the town first formed. These dumps were partially covered over during the 1950s in favor of a county dump. Find those old dumps and you will find artifacts including marbles enough to boggle your mind.
Tinfoil
|
July 14, 2009
to JimF01 : I recommend you read the book 'God is not Great;How religion poisons everything' by Christopher Hitchens. I read a lot out here in the desert.


We encourage readers to share online comments in this forum, but please keep them respectful and constructive. This is not a space for personal attacks, libelous statements, profanity or racist slurs. Comments that stray from the topic of the story or are found to contain abusive language are subject to removal at the Press’ discretion, and the writer responsible will be subject to being blocked from making further comments and have their past comments deleted. Readers may report inappropriate comments by e-mailing the editor at tpnews@tracypress.com.